I dunno, I like the moment when she intuitively presses the mask on the demon later, since she heard this now, it makes it feel a little less… magical.
Then again, I tend to be against excessive exposition, I like figuring things out through context and action, rather than explanation.
A friend of mine fell in love with this comic because he said that it drops you right in and doesn’t explain anything right away, leaving it all extremely mysterious, as we and Allison both have no idea what’s going on.
He indicated that he was saddened by the increase of exposition with the revision.
I do not believe that this will have any sway over your decisions, but perhaps it is a consideration worth considerment.
These new pages are beautiful, but I don’t care for what they do to the rhythm of the story, or to White Chain’s character. Before she was terse, unfriendly, and most of all obtuse. Her idea of basic introductory information was *the creation of the universe* – it made sense to say, but only from her point of view. Now she seems an almost friendly source of exposition: the old White Chain wouldn’t bother to answer your stupid questions.
And I liked being lost in confusion these first few chapters. Everything was beautiful and new and strange. Perhaps I am being curmudgeonly, but the lack of infodump made the mysteries more compelling, not less. That’s my two cents.
But I can’t blame you for ignoring the advice of a devil.
Yeah, I’m always wary of adding exposition, but I think it’s a real pain in the ass for people to not have some base-line understanding of the simple cosmology of the world. I think a lot of people understand it pretty well because of the text under the comic, and I’m not sure that will be included in a print version, so I want to make sure people get a little idea of what’s going on here before it becomes more explicitly clear later.
Now that I think about it, I can’t see an easy way to include all that text. Which is a shame: I adore those little puzzle pieces. It’s absolutely wonderful stuff, but what would you do? Put it at the bottom of every page? Alternate with one page of comic, one page of random text? Just dump them all in the back? Nothing would recreate the way we get information here.
Best of luck sir! I have nothing but admiration for both your project and you skills.
Ah, posted and then realized why I was grumpy in the first place: this page spoils the devil reveal. I was SHOCKED at what unbound devils looked like. And the previous page spoils White Chain’s rant on the seven kings. White Chain yells THEY STILL RULE GIRL, but duh, we found that out on the two page spread.
I think that’s why us commenters are all so up in arms about this. Being released piecemeal, every new bit of setting lore feels hard won to us. We resent having it given so easily to the new folks.
But a printed book, well that’s a different thing entirely. Again, best of luck in figuring all of this out.
I think this gets explained well enough later when we see the explanation of the war, with humans sitting voer an edge and offering masks to a writhing mass of demons. The text is alright, but never really explained anything I hadn’t picked up on other than side stories like Aesma and Meti that act more as background elements in the main story than anything crucial to it.
Though if said textcannot fit alongside the comic in the print version, I would think it could be used in a compainion booklet. It’d be neat to have encycplopedia/liturgy book with little illustrations like the ones in the now-removed page that once had explanations of such things as braided versus unbraided amulet holders.
Why change time to add this? The shape of the universe unfolds itself naturally in full clarity. There is no need to stop and tell what shall be shown. Do so many travelers complain for the lack of hand-holding?
Hmm. In the last panel White Chain says “demons” instead of “devils”. Pretty sure it’s the first time the name’s been used in the comic. I guess that means devils and demons are the same unless it’s intentionally misleading.
Also interesting not all unmasked devils look similar.
Alison, while putton on Nyave’s cloak pauses for a second. A new memory flashes trough her mind and she pretty much ignores it.
White chain, on her way to the Concordance of angels muses about the same thing. They know that space-time has warped around her and her memory’s and they question the validity of it: Nothing is ‘real’ and it doesn’t matter.
(but both find it a happy memory in comparison to the events wich are unfolding at this moment in time.)
I do hope we see the perhaps the either unified or merged beings of the flame. An angel masked, or a devil (demon? the name is now in question) riding a body of ash.
Yeah, this didn’t need to be here. Show, don’t tell – and you already, successfully, showed this. The below-page flavor and rest of the comic already gave the reader as much info as they needed to figure this out.
Why would you retroactively go back and tell us? You are providing no benefit here.
My opinion appears not to be generally shared, here. I am quite a fan of world-building and expansion. This hints at what’s beneath that stone, the turmoil White Chain feels and the obvious interest in the fates of mortals that goes against the general trend of angels.
While retro-changing things often isn’t a good policy, I don’t believe this will have a negative effect on things and in fact improves them for first time readers.
First reader here… I appreciate ALL exposition, all text. I intake all of it, bonus as it is.
This is very dense info. I could spend ~days on each page, looking at all of it, realizing maybe 1/4.
I bet the book is beyond beautiful…
Thank you for all that you do. No complaints or criticisms here.
I don’t know what the old version was like, but I’m glad of an explanation – I’ve never been good at puzzles and my memory is terrible, so subtle things fly over my head.
Plus the red text on black backgrounds is unkind to my eyes, so I tend to avoid the under-comic text and comment threads. Maybe I’m missing out on a lot but trying to read too much gives me a headache.
Thanks for taking the time to discuss that, I feel strongly about this and so really like getting to know more on this kind of field. Do you mind updating your blog post with additional insight? It should be really useful for all of us.
Wow White Chain is one hell of an unreliable narrator
I dunno, I like the moment when she intuitively presses the mask on the demon later, since she heard this now, it makes it feel a little less… magical.
Then again, I tend to be against excessive exposition, I like figuring things out through context and action, rather than explanation.
I think this’ll be the last bit of retroactive exposition I’ll add
You see what you’ve done? no more retrocactive candy.
A friend of mine fell in love with this comic because he said that it drops you right in and doesn’t explain anything right away, leaving it all extremely mysterious, as we and Allison both have no idea what’s going on.
He indicated that he was saddened by the increase of exposition with the revision.
I do not believe that this will have any sway over your decisions, but perhaps it is a consideration worth considerment.
These new pages are beautiful, but I don’t care for what they do to the rhythm of the story, or to White Chain’s character. Before she was terse, unfriendly, and most of all obtuse. Her idea of basic introductory information was *the creation of the universe* – it made sense to say, but only from her point of view. Now she seems an almost friendly source of exposition: the old White Chain wouldn’t bother to answer your stupid questions.
And I liked being lost in confusion these first few chapters. Everything was beautiful and new and strange. Perhaps I am being curmudgeonly, but the lack of infodump made the mysteries more compelling, not less. That’s my two cents.
But I can’t blame you for ignoring the advice of a devil.
Yeah, I’m always wary of adding exposition, but I think it’s a real pain in the ass for people to not have some base-line understanding of the simple cosmology of the world. I think a lot of people understand it pretty well because of the text under the comic, and I’m not sure that will be included in a print version, so I want to make sure people get a little idea of what’s going on here before it becomes more explicitly clear later.
Now that I think about it, I can’t see an easy way to include all that text. Which is a shame: I adore those little puzzle pieces. It’s absolutely wonderful stuff, but what would you do? Put it at the bottom of every page? Alternate with one page of comic, one page of random text? Just dump them all in the back? Nothing would recreate the way we get information here.
Best of luck sir! I have nothing but admiration for both your project and you skills.
Ah, posted and then realized why I was grumpy in the first place: this page spoils the devil reveal. I was SHOCKED at what unbound devils looked like. And the previous page spoils White Chain’s rant on the seven kings. White Chain yells THEY STILL RULE GIRL, but duh, we found that out on the two page spread.
I think that’s why us commenters are all so up in arms about this. Being released piecemeal, every new bit of setting lore feels hard won to us. We resent having it given so easily to the new folks.
But a printed book, well that’s a different thing entirely. Again, best of luck in figuring all of this out.
I think this gets explained well enough later when we see the explanation of the war, with humans sitting voer an edge and offering masks to a writhing mass of demons. The text is alright, but never really explained anything I hadn’t picked up on other than side stories like Aesma and Meti that act more as background elements in the main story than anything crucial to it.
Though if said textcannot fit alongside the comic in the print version, I would think it could be used in a compainion booklet. It’d be neat to have encycplopedia/liturgy book with little illustrations like the ones in the now-removed page that once had explanations of such things as braided versus unbraided amulet holders.
“Before she was terse, unfriendly, and most of all obtuse.” Terse? Sometimes. But sisterbrother loved to hear her tongue wag.
And as always, those angels are SO BAD ASS.
Why change time to add this? The shape of the universe unfolds itself naturally in full clarity. There is no need to stop and tell what shall be shown. Do so many travelers complain for the lack of hand-holding?
Hmm. In the last panel White Chain says “demons” instead of “devils”. Pretty sure it’s the first time the name’s been used in the comic. I guess that means devils and demons are the same unless it’s intentionally misleading.
Also interesting not all unmasked devils look similar.
Alison, while putton on Nyave’s cloak pauses for a second. A new memory flashes trough her mind and she pretty much ignores it.
White chain, on her way to the Concordance of angels muses about the same thing. They know that space-time has warped around her and her memory’s and they question the validity of it: Nothing is ‘real’ and it doesn’t matter.
(but both find it a happy memory in comparison to the events wich are unfolding at this moment in time.)
Remind yourself that over-exposition is a slow and insidious killer.
I’m going to pretend you added that little “e’en” in the dialog just for me.
I enjoy the forms and shapes of the Angels.
But more than that, I enjoy seeing that the wold black flame can have different shapes. As the cold flame did, so this is logical.
Although, one could wonder, what does “reach heaven through violence” truly mean ?
I do hope we see the perhaps the either unified or merged beings of the flame. An angel masked, or a devil (demon? the name is now in question) riding a body of ash.
Knowledge limits fear. Until it is suspected to be lies. Then the twisting fun begins anew.
Cold flame, dark flame and mortal ash, huh? Suddenly the comic’s prevalent colour scheme of red, blue and grey makes a lot more sense ^^
Unnecessary exposition, the reader finds this out through the comic elsewhere. Show don’t tell (which was already happening).
….is Chains smiling?
And the flame over her head flared, too. I suspect she has a thing for long-winded stories, but scarcely an opportunity to tell them.
A shame really. Everyone needs a hobby, and I think I’d enjoy trading histories over coffee.
Yeah, this didn’t need to be here. Show, don’t tell – and you already, successfully, showed this. The below-page flavor and rest of the comic already gave the reader as much info as they needed to figure this out.
Why would you retroactively go back and tell us? You are providing no benefit here.
My opinion appears not to be generally shared, here. I am quite a fan of world-building and expansion. This hints at what’s beneath that stone, the turmoil White Chain feels and the obvious interest in the fates of mortals that goes against the general trend of angels.
While retro-changing things often isn’t a good policy, I don’t believe this will have a negative effect on things and in fact improves them for first time readers.
First reader here… I appreciate ALL exposition, all text. I intake all of it, bonus as it is.
This is very dense info. I could spend ~days on each page, looking at all of it, realizing maybe 1/4.
I bet the book is beyond beautiful…
Thank you for all that you do. No complaints or criticisms here.
I’d consider having these infodumps as an appendix or similar backmatter. They are valuable, yet don’t need to disrupt the flow of the narrative.
ya’ll saying he did too much exposition but i’m still confused so congrats, i guess you got what you wanted. :/
So many experiences happening for one story. Yet, this world is vastly intriguing even in this form.
In my time I have spoken with angels and made Bargins with Devils, both have knowledge, its just a matter of getting them to teach you
“An ancient compact”
Oh, spelling errors.
I don’t know what the old version was like, but I’m glad of an explanation – I’ve never been good at puzzles and my memory is terrible, so subtle things fly over my head.
Plus the red text on black backgrounds is unkind to my eyes, so I tend to avoid the under-comic text and comment threads. Maybe I’m missing out on a lot but trying to read too much gives me a headache.
Thanks for taking the time to discuss that, I feel strongly about this and so really like getting to know more on this kind of field. Do you mind updating your blog post with additional insight? It should be really useful for all of us.
Looking forward to you sharing more information, I have been looking for it for days