I dunno, I think they should start with a noun and then add a description? So using the OP’s username, I suggest 69 Gleeful Youth Roars Unto the Heavens in a Raucous Expression of Joy?
Dunno; we’ve seen angel names like 22 Shake off the Sodden Words of the Faithless, 12 Questioning Fate, and 36 Will Not Give Ground to Sinners, so it’d seem that a noun is not mandatory.
Right. Take credit for it, why wouldn’t you. Not that I didn’t put eighty five plot points and carefully situated chance meetings in their paths for seven months to make sure this scene happened on camera~ *grumble grumble*
this comic has become a straight white males personal fetishization material
it’s sad because it has cool concepts and world building but the portrayal of this sudden lesbian relationship is entirely and utterly problematic and very much seen through the male gaze
you do realize grandiose statements about how ‘Terrible and Problematique’ a work of fiction is and how you must cleanse your holy hands of it… don’t really do anything other than make you look like a moog in front of everybody, right? the only person you’re embarrassing right now is yourself. honestly i’ve been going around actual activist circles enough that your tone reads completely insincere and dare i say false.
as a male, with a gaze, it doesn’t strike me that way. if i were more grouchy, i might complain about pandering to homosexuals/forced diversity. but that would also be an extreme reaction. i’ll choose to just enjoy the comic without using it as a source of outrage to fuel my ego-fire.
I don’t think they actually meant it’s pandering, they were just playing devil’s advocate how you could use the logic of hate’s initial statement of this being a “sudden lesbian relationship” and twist it to be on the other end of the spectrum, even though it’s been brewing since Cio joined the gang that anyone with at least half a mind was able to see.
Why it’s a healthy relationship. Everything we’ve seen so far has been fine this is honestly tame compared to other comics ive read written by lesbians it’s also hornier than some I’ve read by lesbians. But like i feel as if ur just trying to stir shit up so like chill. also what sudden relationship?? This shits been teased since Alice-Un and Cio met. Abbadon has worked hard to make this comics veiw positive on sex and Gender and i doubt he’ll fuck it up anytime soon
Ok then im gonna be more direct n boring. What comics written by lesbians with mature content can you recommend, asking for a lesbian (me) because i’d like to look into them.
I’ve been in social activism (actually doing stuff, not just complaining on the internet and going to some marches) for a while, and the two groups of people who contribute absolutely nothing to the betterment of anything and I can never rely on are basically those two types of people. People with such closed minds they have headaches, and with such open minds their brains fell out of their ears…
Sorry, but the above was not actually an example of an open mind. In fact, the idea that this page is only appealing to straight white males is a pretty close-minded view of sexuality.
Maybe there are people “so open minded their brains fall out” but those people have little in common with SJWs and their overzealous ilk.
Forgive me for taking your other post seriously: you are so wrong, and that is such an offensive and marginalising statement it is completely laughable.
im wasting my time responding to an obvious troll as im like, responding in good faith but here i am anyways
‘sudden lesbian relationship’ i mean, its not like Cio hasnt read as wlw since chapter one, like when she expressed ire about allison having a boyfriend, when talking about being allisons unofficial biographer exaggerating her story, maybe throwing in a gf, and just very generally thrown off gay vibes. besides, if you’re so upset about fetish material, why didnt you leave when the battle nun showed off her chastity belt and boob spikes?
like i get being wary of gay content written by a presumably heterosexual, cisgender man, because it often is fetishistic, or actually queerbaiting, or someone dies after they get together, but abbadon seems to actually be making an attempt at writing a good story, that happens to have a wlw couple starring- or at least some women who are fwb- in addition to a character arc involving gender that I find incredibly relatable, and seems like hes willing to listen to his audience on shit- when its constructive, unlike this comment i wrote far too much in response to lmao
No, because Abbadon isn’t a boring transphobic jackass. That “joke”, if one can even call it as such, is the deadest horse since the one Death rode in on. Quit beating it.
The fact that there are fans who make attack helicopter jokes, however, and the state of this comment thread in general, do not exactly reflect well.
(also ‘hate’ is a really obvious troll and the fact that so few people even realize that also speaks volumes. to make it more clear to anyone else reading this: the person who made that comment does not believe the things that they are saying, and are acting as a caricature of people that commenter dislikes.)
complaining about the existence of lesbian relationship and framing it as feminism is still homophobic and therefore problematique in itself. begone homophobe, thou arn’t wanted here.
At the risk of sounding like I’m defending “hate” (which I’m not), the comic world seems quite full of homosexual relationships of late. To clarify; out of the last 5 graphic novels I’ve read (about 2 weeks worth), 3 of them have homosexual couples in them and in 2 of which they are main characters (the counts bump up a notch if we add in K6BD).
While I have nothing against it, it does seem very disproportionate, and does feel as if the comic world is pandering a bit.
As far as being this straight white male’s “personal fetishization material”… Not so much. I can’t say that I find Cio physically attractive ~ although I do really like the character. Sex with a spikey, scaley alien with carapace-like bits? Nah, I’m good, thanks.
for your 1st point, lets call that 6 series (at the least) with lgbt rep, versus how many that don’t? yeah, theres gay content out there, but theres so much more that isnt- and thats not addressing whether any of those series were produced by queer artists; its hardly pandering if theyre gay themselves.
and to the second, i say, more for us gay monsterfuckers lmao
Amen! lol
Also there’s a disproportionate amount of queer artists in webcomics because as a creative medium, it has a low barrier for entry and doesn’t have a historical, established dominance of straight white guys (eg Hollywood). So a big chunk of creators are queer or are close friends with other queer artists.
Not pandering, in my opinion, just bringing to life stories based on their lived experiences.
I would argue that comics DO have a historical dominance of straight white guys – at least here in America. I had a good laugh over the people that were offended by the white kid wearing a Black Panther sweater not long ago. Hellooo? Black Panther? Yeah, invented by a pair of white guys (straight as well, afaik).
But I do get where you are coming from. Most folks with a creative nature are (or at least seem to be) less prone to be judgemental in general ways such as the current topic.
Pander isn’t the right word. More like cliche’. “Oh all the most IN-teresting comics have gay main characters now. It’s just so trendy, don’t you think?”
I only cited the 6 most recent graphic novels that I’ve read because I didn’t want to go back TOO far (like I said, about 2 weeks of reading). Read a few more books over the weekend (several of the same or previously mentioned series’), adding two more homosexual mains to the list. One of which the main character wasn’t revealed as lesbian until book 3 in the series (or I just wasn’t paying attention early on).
So, of the last 12 graphic novels I’ve read (not counting K6BD), 6 have homosexual characters, mostly lesbian (presumably for “male interest”), and most are main characters (Walking Dead has gay characters, but they aren’t exactly main characters).
As far as writing about their “lived experiences’, I’m not sure how many gay comic writers have faced a zombie / virus appocalypse, or had an Elder God possess them, but I’m guessing it’s relatively few.
It just seems very cliche’ that so many of the comics out there seem to require lesbian main characters. Does it take a woman to love a strong female lead? Hmm… looking closer, it does seem that the only female lead (from recent reads) that wasn’t gay is Hit-Girl. But she’s still pretty young, and doesn’t have a boyfriend yet, so maybe in the future?
I should clarify a bit further: 9 different series (12 books) in the last 2 weeks. 4 have lesbian main characters, 1 has gay male and female secondary characters.
Maybe I’m reading too many comics with strong female leads? Darn white male fetishes! LOL!
And the pro-LGBT content is still less than a percent of what you could be reading that strongly advertises straight relationships, or even anti-LGBT content. There’s no sense in complaining. If you’re picking up mostly webcomics, well – this is where creatives feel safe to put out their works that don’t conform to the established rhetoric and ‘acceptable’ dogma. And creatives are, more often than not, the attacked/abused sort, which can also be a lot of folks who don’t fit the norm. Ergo there’s a lot of interplay between being an internet creative and being LGBT or one of those other things.
Ergo, complaining about it means you essentially built a house in a field of rainbows and wondered why everything is colorful outside your window.
Actually, I don’t tend to read webcomics. Discovered K6BD after the first print book came out.
Was I complaining? I thought it was more of a statement that lesbian leading women are cliche’. As if the comic world is saying “Strong woman? Oh, she must be gay.” It is so “in your face” that if it were all SWM’s doing the writing they would be called out for it. But because many of the writers / creators are from the LGBTQ community, it must be ok.
Seriously, I would not be suprised if the next incarnation of Wonder Woman featured her as a lesbian (I don’t read WW, so maybe this has already happened?). IMO, they are painting a picture that being a lesbian is the only way a woman could possibly be strong or heroic. Sure, that’s empowering for LGBTQ’s, but isn’t it equally degrading to Women in general?
Exactly this. So many other medium are controlled by corporate interests that won’t publish your stories unless they have straight white male leads, because according to their economic data based exclusively on the sales of comics with straight white male leads, only comics with straight white male leads sell. The webcomic scene has grown up without much of that gatekeeping, and the result’s been a greater amount of diversity. Diverse characters and diverse storytelling, because it turns out that a lot of those factors that keep down LGBTQ or minority representation also squash a lot of interesting ideas in general, so there’s a lot of webcomics like K6BD where those two things go hand-in-hand.
Shy Guy, did you not read the part where I said actual PRINT comics, from mainstream publishers? I’m not talking about webcomics. K6BD is the only webcomic I read. Your argument is not correct. Lesbian leads are apparently what sells comics these days.
1 out of 10 people identifies as LGBTQ+, and I’d estimate that a full 1 in 3 has had homosexual experiences or feelings. Making the main character queer is probably because of the compelling story of the “secret life” and personal shame and heavy stigma surrounding sexuality, but real life does involve queer people. If your comic has a cast with 20 characters, you need at least 2 Gays ™ to have accurate representation.
Chances are, the author has already made characters in certain webcomics who are gay, and just isn’t talking about it.
Throughout the history of American literature and art, we’ve been told that like 1 in 100000 people is a Homo. That’s not statistically true. There can be stories without any gay characters or gay things at all, but generally those will be because there are only like 3 characters in them or because of a biased set (e.g. a couples church retreat).
What’s fetishistic about this!? It’s not like Abbadon’s gonna follow this up with fifteen pages of Allison and Cio fucking! They’re characters, in a relationship! Just cuz Abbadon’s not a lesbian woman doesn’t mean he’s automatically a creepy perv for writing characters in a lesbian relationship. C’mon!
Ok…
1: There has been tension between these two for a while.
2: We just did a 1 year timeskip. A year of training and living together is plenty of time for a sexual relationship to develop.
Yeah, because ABSOLUTELY NOTHING HAPPENS IF IT’S OFFSCREEN!!!!!1111
There was a kiss, and then a year passed. A full year. Honestly, I’d like some flashbacks to flesh out the development from beginning to now, but if you expect people to take multiple years to go from interest to sex, my friend, *your* standards are antiquated.
You realize this type of reverse anti-vassal argument only serves to alienate and radicalize opinions. Sure you may think your doing ‘a service’ by inciting vitriolic reactions to opinions you obviously don’t have as a way to drum support for the opposite opinions you do hold, but you do it without subtly and only illustrate the empty Poe positions on both sides.
You failed. You failed in such a cringe way too. I find craven cowards like you and your ilk so amusing. It is nice to know there are still those out there that some how have the capability, despite their mental handicap, to type up a window into their mind’s eye of impotent self reflection of inner failure in such a concise way. Thank you. 🙂
Not really, because all the people exactly like the troll have completely failed to grasp that this is a troll, and are seizing on this as ‘proof’ of MUH EVIL SJWS. Like they always do
I’ve worked SJ work for years now and these people are real and serious about what they believe. To call them a troll is dismissive and does not go for bettering what the social justice community can look like in the future. We need to work on making ourselves better!
Let’s not get ahead of ourselves and act like it’s impossible to critique this from the viewpoint of it being possibly influenced by the male gaze. It isn’t. It really, really isn’t.
OP called it “personal fetishization material” and a “sudden lesbian relationship” that’s just not true. As for the male gaze- that’s what you get with a male author… I mean he’s never been in a lesbian relationship before, I don’t fault him too much. Besides, a handful of pages in a giant comic with recurring female characters is good considering Allison as a whole isn’t being portrayed through the male gaze.
But she has been, though. Read the last book. We had to endure seeing her shirt torn in just such a way that we received several nip-slips. This may seem minor, but considering the amount of thought Abaddon surely puts into each and every panel, it’s clearly a conscious choice. When put in combination with Cio’s overall design change during the heist and the horrible 0001 splash page that even he admitted was “too horny”…it doesn’t paint a pretty picture.
excuse me, it quite literally painted a pretty picture. stop being a fundamentalist prude.
“oh no! sexuality exists” “oh no! men are enjoying something of a sexual nature!” “oh no! we saw nipple!”
whatever happened to live and let live? why is the world filled with zealots who run around trying to ruin other people’s idea of a good time? it’s art for yisun’s sake, literally no one is being hurt by this.
“excuse me, it quite literally painted a pretty picture. stop being a fundamentalist prude.”
Nope! I’m going to critique everything straight men do, because it’s overwhelmingly gross. Sorry! If it makes you feel any better you have tons of sexist content to enjoy literally anywhere else.
Their relationship was anything but sudden, and if you missed that after reading for two years then you are dense indeed. In any case, go take your hate and have a relationship with it, m’kay? Bye now!
I have a lot of sympathy with this point of view. While their relationship has often been hinted to and was the object of ceasless ‘shipping’ in the comments, it was never properly built in the narrative. Along with a couple of time skips, this has produced a homesxual relationship devoid of any nuance or believable foundations. This is frustrating, and it does appear to pander to a certain objectifying male viewpoint. That said, I believe that Abbadon is attempting to present gender and sexuality in an overwhelmingly positive way. I don’t believe that the failure to create an nuanced and sensitive relationship between Allison and Cio reflects any boorishness on his part, but might rather indicate his awareness of the issue. As pointed out, Abaddon is likely a straight cis man with limited LGBTQ experience, so may not feel confident in tackling such a relationship in his writing. As such, the slightly hamfisted, cookie cutter, stereotypical relationship with time jumps and shaky foundations is what we get. I don’t think we should be too critical of someone who is attempting to present LGBTQ characters in a positive way, even if it is lacking greater understanding. It still feels like steps in the right direction to me.
Would now be a good time to mention that Abbadon has a sister who is a lesbian and is close friends with many other queer people?
Also what an utterly back-handed compliment. This is only the first page where it’s been confirmed that Allison and Cio are in a relationship and you (and others) are immediately assuming it’s going to be solely sexualized and male-gazey just because Allison is asking about sex?
I don’t agree that the relationship wasn’t built in the narrative. It was clear to me that Cio was into Allison from very early on. I think I first twigged to it somewhere around the drinking contest with Princess. Cio and Allison have been dancing around each other for almost the entire comic.
what exactly do you mean by ” a certain objectifying male viewpoint”? like what is the exact view point? cause to me it seems more like the second part of your post than this.
We won’t miss you. Here we have a healthy lesbian relationship instead of the strong female lead pining after her kind-of-skeezy male hookup, and you’re saying it’s the evils of men. As a steadfast member of the LGBT community: You SJW and third-wave feminazis caused us far more damage and exile than your small minds could ever compute, right when we were on the verge of acceptance. Leave now.
1.) This relationship was not “sudden”, it’s kind of been laid out since the beginning of the series that Allison never really felt she had a place among people back on earth, the only reason she ever hooked up with the shifty dude in the first place is because she didn’t want to be made fun of for being a virgin, and as we saw in the heist arc, she was never very good at introspection. Like…..when you look back on it, there’s a good chance she was written as a lesbian from the very beginning.
2.)In what way is it fetishistic??? It’s not at all tainted by the male gaze; there’s nothing here to say that this isn’t a lasting, genuine relationship (in fact, the end of the heist arc showed us it had great potential to be one), and nothing to say that a relationship with a man would be in any way better.
3.) As a lesbian who is LOVING these new pages so far, I feel that I have the utmost authority to say: “Kindly fuck off from whence ye came, foul pissant”
As a lesbian disaster myself I don’t know what you’re seeing in this b e c a u s e tiny binch demoness in glasses ravishing me sarcastically is exactly my kind of fantasy
Ok but…lol. They’ve saved each other’s lives countless times, Cio was writing fanfic about her since the beginning, Allison called Cio her best friend, etc. etc. etc. I know you’re trolling but it has to be said… this is one of the best portrayals of badass women in fiction I’ve ever read, written by a dude or not. Allison is written just like any character in an epic, and it’s feminist AF because it doesn’t even matter she’s a woman. If she was a dude you bet your ass he’d be banging one of his companions.
I shouldn’t, but I have to. I refer to the panel two pages ago with Allison sitting butt-naked in a bathtub reading a book and gobbling down ramen in the least male gaze way possible. Cio may be an absolute sex idol, but come ON
All that fucking development of their characters and now you’re mad because Allison suddenly made up her mind after all? Did you completely forget how this character was introduced?
It seems like this is a game they play now. Cio doesn’t want to be too pushy since that is something the old her would of done (remember the comic right before the time jump when her and Allison shared a cig?) but she is also a demon who is likely ALWAYS dtf. I read the “wanna have sex?” In an almost exasperated tone, having in because CIO, being the minx that she is, would continue to not subtly push the subject. It seems like this thing happens often.
I like it. It feels fairly real, mundane and cute.
In Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism, the world of humans is known as “the land of plum trees”. Plus a dozen or so metaphysical references of similar significance. For Christian mystics an apple would be analogous object.
Confusion stems from the widespread nickname of “Indian Blackberry” given to that particular fruit despite it otherwise being known as “Java plum”, “Portuguese plum”, and “Malabar plum”.
More specifically, it’s gay if the feminine aspects of Cio are what attract Allison. Yet if the demon aspects are what attract Allison to Cio, then it isn’t gay, it’s closer to xenophilia.
At this point I’m honestly kinda expecting ‘Fuck’ to be some kind of Throne only board game, like monopoly but with gods instead of streets. Failing that, it’s a ruse so they can both write fanfiction in Alison’s room without fear of being discovered by their house-mates.
Ok, we need details. How does one have sex with a demon? We (I assume I can speak for all) know how the human body works, but how does it work for demons?
THE BLACK CHILDREN OF YS-AESMA WERE UNBOUND AND FORMLESS IN MIND AND BODY WHEN THE CONQUERING KING FIRST TORE INTO HEAVEN AND SLEW OUR BROTHERS. IT WAS FIRST LATER, THROUGH THE HANDS OF HIS DEMIURGES, THAT DEVILS WERE GRANTED MINDS AND BODIES. IT STANDS TO REASON THAT THEIR FORMS EMULATED THEIR CREATORS IN AT LEAST SOME WAYS, SO PHYSICAL COMPATIBILITY IS LIKELY LESS OF AN ISSUE.
Devils are made of formless chaos which really means “whatever’s most convenient at the moment” so I can’t imagine the process is too difficult or dissimilar to the purely human equivalent.
Well, there’s this flexible tail with a fuzzy tip, which is a highly erogenic zone. First, you tease it a bit, but when the ravaging begins, this tail can be applied in any position you (or the demon) prefer. Tomorrow, if you ask nice, I’ll tell you about the lips, the breasts, and the very unspeakable nether regions…
That’s in the same vein as “wait, how can two women have sex, they don’t have a p****”? Cio isn’t completely covered in shell, and if she has a sex drive she presumably has erogenous zones. And then yeah, there’s that possibly-prehensile tail with its furry tuft….
PLUM! That… was not the thing I expected, and that’s also great.
Fanservice strikes me much lesser, this sort of thing is definetely not my cup of tea. *pondered the simbolism of teacups in this comic and nodded* Yet anuway, KSBD is fucking great, be it with or without fucking,
Contemplate, my lovelies, the Grand Enemy That Is Called I, and the tale of the Lie of the Iron Plum.
YISUN is the finest of liars, and like all of that exalted sorority, he is wont to repeat his favorites from time to time.
i knew it. the double fakeout. we’ve been bamboozled again
And what a bamboozling it was!
Alright, time for me to Roar Unto the Heavens in a raucous Expression of Glee, because that’s the just the B e s t.
Roar Unto the Heavens in a Racuous Expression of Glee is a valid angel name, if you just put a number at the beginning.
69 Roar Unto the Heavens in a Racuous Expression of Glee
Life can be fine
That name.
I like it.
It is mine now.
And there was much rejoyce.
I dunno, I think they should start with a noun and then add a description? So using the OP’s username, I suggest 69 Gleeful Youth Roars Unto the Heavens in a Raucous Expression of Joy?
Dunno; we’ve seen angel names like 22 Shake off the Sodden Words of the Faithless, 12 Questioning Fate, and 36 Will Not Give Ground to Sinners, so it’d seem that a noun is not mandatory.
Besides what Arianod said, “Gleeful” isn’t a noun. It’s part of a noun phrase, yes, but that’s not what you said…
I like the new Allison body … I’ve fond memories of bedding an Allison once … No demonic intervention, fortunately.
You did whoopie with a #BuffGal? Lucky. Much envy.
Is that a plum then?
It’s purple, and not an apple.
So, it’s either a plum.
Or a purple ass-peach, a fruit native to Throne.
Looks like a plum, crunches like an apple.
A little apple. A little plum
It’s an Applum
<3
It’s obviously a plumple.
It might be. Or it could be Yisun in a clever and dashing disguise.
Isn’t everything Yisun in a clever and dashing disguise?
Even the bumbling ratty-ass fool in the clever and dashing disguise, yes.
It’s a chunk of iron convinced otherwise.
Tha came through for all of us on discord today. The expressions are lovely besides.
What is the discord server? I’ve been searching and haven’t been able to find it anywhere.
look into your heart and you will find the true answer
LOL that’s great
WE DID IT LADS
“We.”
Right. Take credit for it, why wouldn’t you. Not that I didn’t put eighty five plot points and carefully situated chance meetings in their paths for seven months to make sure this scene happened on camera~ *grumble grumble*
Ladies and gentlemen… we gottem.
We’ve been had lads. And the worst part is we enjoyed it from the start.
AND THEN THEY FUCKED
I understood that reference.
this comic has become a straight white males personal fetishization material
it’s sad because it has cool concepts and world building but the portrayal of this sudden lesbian relationship is entirely and utterly problematic and very much seen through the male gaze
guess after 2 years of reading i’m finally done
DON’T LET THE DOOR HIT YOUR ASS ON THE WAY OUT
you do realize grandiose statements about how ‘Terrible and Problematique’ a work of fiction is and how you must cleanse your holy hands of it… don’t really do anything other than make you look like a moog in front of everybody, right? the only person you’re embarrassing right now is yourself. honestly i’ve been going around actual activist circles enough that your tone reads completely insincere and dare i say false.
as a male, with a gaze, it doesn’t strike me that way. if i were more grouchy, i might complain about pandering to homosexuals/forced diversity. but that would also be an extreme reaction. i’ll choose to just enjoy the comic without using it as a source of outrage to fuel my ego-fire.
How is this “pandering”?and forced Diversity please its set in Throne for hells sake.
I don’t think they actually meant it’s pandering, they were just playing devil’s advocate how you could use the logic of hate’s initial statement of this being a “sudden lesbian relationship” and twist it to be on the other end of the spectrum, even though it’s been brewing since Cio joined the gang that anyone with at least half a mind was able to see.
Why it’s a healthy relationship. Everything we’ve seen so far has been fine this is honestly tame compared to other comics ive read written by lesbians it’s also hornier than some I’ve read by lesbians. But like i feel as if ur just trying to stir shit up so like chill. also what sudden relationship?? This shits been teased since Alice-Un and Cio met. Abbadon has worked hard to make this comics veiw positive on sex and Gender and i doubt he’ll fuck it up anytime soon
Can u give a hint to where those…. untame lesbian comics are?
I love you people.
That was a really gross comment though.
Ok then im gonna be more direct n boring. What comics written by lesbians with mature content can you recommend, asking for a lesbian (me) because i’d like to look into them.
The writer of this webcomic is a lesbian?
Last I was aware, Abbaddon was a dude.
I was under the impression Abbaddon was a cat.
you dunkasses abbadon is just a big ol’ eye
Taking a nick “hate” and then trolling the author with hatemail.
Subtle.
lmao how do you go about life getting so mad about shit all the time
two ladies gonna bone after a fuckload of sexual tension. *oh no*
fuck off with your puritanical retardation already.
Widdle babbu cannot reading comprehension and basic grasp of subtext.
StraightWhiteMan point of view: “OMG, they’re lesbian, DATZ WRONG!”
SJWpig point of view: “OMG, it’s straight white mails fetish comics, DATZ WRONG!”
…Lol ).
I’ve been in social activism (actually doing stuff, not just complaining on the internet and going to some marches) for a while, and the two groups of people who contribute absolutely nothing to the betterment of anything and I can never rely on are basically those two types of people. People with such closed minds they have headaches, and with such open minds their brains fell out of their ears…
Sorry, but the above was not actually an example of an open mind. In fact, the idea that this page is only appealing to straight white males is a pretty close-minded view of sexuality.
Maybe there are people “so open minded their brains fall out” but those people have little in common with SJWs and their overzealous ilk.
“the idea that this page is only appealing to straight white males is a pretty close-minded view of sexuality.”
Let’s not travel into self-delusion and pretend that most content of WLW isn’t geared towards men.
Forgive me for taking your other post seriously: you are so wrong, and that is such an offensive and marginalising statement it is completely laughable.
Thankfully you don’t seem to be very well read on the subject, or intelligent at all, so your opinion is completely worthless. Glad we had this talk!
Appeal to authority + ad hominem, do not pass go, do not collect $200.
Very cute.
Touché
Lesbian point of view: “Yay! Devil girls need love toooooo!”
im wasting my time responding to an obvious troll as im like, responding in good faith but here i am anyways
‘sudden lesbian relationship’ i mean, its not like Cio hasnt read as wlw since chapter one, like when she expressed ire about allison having a boyfriend, when talking about being allisons unofficial biographer exaggerating her story, maybe throwing in a gf, and just very generally thrown off gay vibes. besides, if you’re so upset about fetish material, why didnt you leave when the battle nun showed off her chastity belt and boob spikes?
like i get being wary of gay content written by a presumably heterosexual, cisgender man, because it often is fetishistic, or actually queerbaiting, or someone dies after they get together, but abbadon seems to actually be making an attempt at writing a good story, that happens to have a wlw couple starring- or at least some women who are fwb- in addition to a character arc involving gender that I find incredibly relatable, and seems like hes willing to listen to his audience on shit- when its constructive, unlike this comment i wrote far too much in response to lmao
^THIS IS THE GOOD SHIT^
tbh I assumed abbadon was a lesbian. are they really a man?
you didn’t figure that out after that 00001 page?
Honestly until I heard his real name I assumed Abbadon was a queer trans lady.
For my part, I am convinced Abbadon identifies as an Attack Helicopter. How else to explain what is written; “Reach Heaven Through Violence.”
No, because Abbadon isn’t a boring transphobic jackass. That “joke”, if one can even call it as such, is the deadest horse since the one Death rode in on. Quit beating it.
The fact that there are fans who make attack helicopter jokes, however, and the state of this comment thread in general, do not exactly reflect well.
(also ‘hate’ is a really obvious troll and the fact that so few people even realize that also speaks volumes. to make it more clear to anyone else reading this: the person who made that comment does not believe the things that they are saying, and are acting as a caricature of people that commenter dislikes.)
complaining about the existence of lesbian relationship and framing it as feminism is still homophobic and therefore problematique in itself. begone homophobe, thou arn’t wanted here.
At the risk of sounding like I’m defending “hate” (which I’m not), the comic world seems quite full of homosexual relationships of late. To clarify; out of the last 5 graphic novels I’ve read (about 2 weeks worth), 3 of them have homosexual couples in them and in 2 of which they are main characters (the counts bump up a notch if we add in K6BD).
While I have nothing against it, it does seem very disproportionate, and does feel as if the comic world is pandering a bit.
As far as being this straight white male’s “personal fetishization material”… Not so much. I can’t say that I find Cio physically attractive ~ although I do really like the character. Sex with a spikey, scaley alien with carapace-like bits? Nah, I’m good, thanks.
for your 1st point, lets call that 6 series (at the least) with lgbt rep, versus how many that don’t? yeah, theres gay content out there, but theres so much more that isnt- and thats not addressing whether any of those series were produced by queer artists; its hardly pandering if theyre gay themselves.
and to the second, i say, more for us gay monsterfuckers lmao
Amen! lol
Also there’s a disproportionate amount of queer artists in webcomics because as a creative medium, it has a low barrier for entry and doesn’t have a historical, established dominance of straight white guys (eg Hollywood). So a big chunk of creators are queer or are close friends with other queer artists.
Not pandering, in my opinion, just bringing to life stories based on their lived experiences.
Also, just like Christian Rock, it gives you an immediate audience when you appeal to niche markets with free material like webcomics.
I would argue that comics DO have a historical dominance of straight white guys – at least here in America. I had a good laugh over the people that were offended by the white kid wearing a Black Panther sweater not long ago. Hellooo? Black Panther? Yeah, invented by a pair of white guys (straight as well, afaik).
But I do get where you are coming from. Most folks with a creative nature are (or at least seem to be) less prone to be judgemental in general ways such as the current topic.
Pander isn’t the right word. More like cliche’. “Oh all the most IN-teresting comics have gay main characters now. It’s just so trendy, don’t you think?”
I only cited the 6 most recent graphic novels that I’ve read because I didn’t want to go back TOO far (like I said, about 2 weeks of reading). Read a few more books over the weekend (several of the same or previously mentioned series’), adding two more homosexual mains to the list. One of which the main character wasn’t revealed as lesbian until book 3 in the series (or I just wasn’t paying attention early on).
So, of the last 12 graphic novels I’ve read (not counting K6BD), 6 have homosexual characters, mostly lesbian (presumably for “male interest”), and most are main characters (Walking Dead has gay characters, but they aren’t exactly main characters).
As far as writing about their “lived experiences’, I’m not sure how many gay comic writers have faced a zombie / virus appocalypse, or had an Elder God possess them, but I’m guessing it’s relatively few.
It just seems very cliche’ that so many of the comics out there seem to require lesbian main characters. Does it take a woman to love a strong female lead? Hmm… looking closer, it does seem that the only female lead (from recent reads) that wasn’t gay is Hit-Girl. But she’s still pretty young, and doesn’t have a boyfriend yet, so maybe in the future?
I should clarify a bit further: 9 different series (12 books) in the last 2 weeks. 4 have lesbian main characters, 1 has gay male and female secondary characters.
Maybe I’m reading too many comics with strong female leads? Darn white male fetishes! LOL!
And the pro-LGBT content is still less than a percent of what you could be reading that strongly advertises straight relationships, or even anti-LGBT content. There’s no sense in complaining. If you’re picking up mostly webcomics, well – this is where creatives feel safe to put out their works that don’t conform to the established rhetoric and ‘acceptable’ dogma. And creatives are, more often than not, the attacked/abused sort, which can also be a lot of folks who don’t fit the norm. Ergo there’s a lot of interplay between being an internet creative and being LGBT or one of those other things.
Ergo, complaining about it means you essentially built a house in a field of rainbows and wondered why everything is colorful outside your window.
Actually, I don’t tend to read webcomics. Discovered K6BD after the first print book came out.
Was I complaining? I thought it was more of a statement that lesbian leading women are cliche’. As if the comic world is saying “Strong woman? Oh, she must be gay.” It is so “in your face” that if it were all SWM’s doing the writing they would be called out for it. But because many of the writers / creators are from the LGBTQ community, it must be ok.
Seriously, I would not be suprised if the next incarnation of Wonder Woman featured her as a lesbian (I don’t read WW, so maybe this has already happened?). IMO, they are painting a picture that being a lesbian is the only way a woman could possibly be strong or heroic. Sure, that’s empowering for LGBTQ’s, but isn’t it equally degrading to Women in general?
Keep trying, brother. I’m sure you’ll be a master concern troll in no time at all.
19, go back to your “depths”. The adults are talking.
Exactly this. So many other medium are controlled by corporate interests that won’t publish your stories unless they have straight white male leads, because according to their economic data based exclusively on the sales of comics with straight white male leads, only comics with straight white male leads sell. The webcomic scene has grown up without much of that gatekeeping, and the result’s been a greater amount of diversity. Diverse characters and diverse storytelling, because it turns out that a lot of those factors that keep down LGBTQ or minority representation also squash a lot of interesting ideas in general, so there’s a lot of webcomics like K6BD where those two things go hand-in-hand.
Shy Guy, did you not read the part where I said actual PRINT comics, from mainstream publishers? I’m not talking about webcomics. K6BD is the only webcomic I read. Your argument is not correct. Lesbian leads are apparently what sells comics these days.
1 out of 10 people identifies as LGBTQ+, and I’d estimate that a full 1 in 3 has had homosexual experiences or feelings. Making the main character queer is probably because of the compelling story of the “secret life” and personal shame and heavy stigma surrounding sexuality, but real life does involve queer people. If your comic has a cast with 20 characters, you need at least 2 Gays ™ to have accurate representation.
Chances are, the author has already made characters in certain webcomics who are gay, and just isn’t talking about it.
Throughout the history of American literature and art, we’ve been told that like 1 in 100000 people is a Homo. That’s not statistically true. There can be stories without any gay characters or gay things at all, but generally those will be because there are only like 3 characters in them or because of a biased set (e.g. a couples church retreat).
Troll. Pretending to be offended and using “sjw” buzz-words to do it. Don’t give this “hate” dude the time of day.
Not a troll, I’ve seen this stuff before in the KSBD fanbase… and in real life…
What’s fetishistic about this!? It’s not like Abbadon’s gonna follow this up with fifteen pages of Allison and Cio fucking! They’re characters, in a relationship! Just cuz Abbadon’s not a lesbian woman doesn’t mean he’s automatically a creepy perv for writing characters in a lesbian relationship. C’mon!
Ok…
1: There has been tension between these two for a while.
2: We just did a 1 year timeskip. A year of training and living together is plenty of time for a sexual relationship to develop.
Yeah, because ABSOLUTELY NOTHING HAPPENS IF IT’S OFFSCREEN!!!!!1111
There was a kiss, and then a year passed. A full year. Honestly, I’d like some flashbacks to flesh out the development from beginning to now, but if you expect people to take multiple years to go from interest to sex, my friend, *your* standards are antiquated.
Not ours.
If this were really fetishistic it wouldn’t have taken 2 years
Go back under your bridge, little troll.
You realize this type of reverse anti-vassal argument only serves to alienate and radicalize opinions. Sure you may think your doing ‘a service’ by inciting vitriolic reactions to opinions you obviously don’t have as a way to drum support for the opposite opinions you do hold, but you do it without subtly and only illustrate the empty Poe positions on both sides.
You failed. You failed in such a cringe way too. I find craven cowards like you and your ilk so amusing. It is nice to know there are still those out there that some how have the capability, despite their mental handicap, to type up a window into their mind’s eye of impotent self reflection of inner failure in such a concise way. Thank you. 🙂
Not really, because all the people exactly like the troll have completely failed to grasp that this is a troll, and are seizing on this as ‘proof’ of MUH EVIL SJWS. Like they always do
Obvious anti-SJW troll appropriating social justice language to make the SJWs look bad is obvious.
Oh god you’re right
I’ve worked SJ work for years now and these people are real and serious about what they believe. To call them a troll is dismissive and does not go for bettering what the social justice community can look like in the future. We need to work on making ourselves better!
Let’s not get ahead of ourselves and act like it’s impossible to critique this from the viewpoint of it being possibly influenced by the male gaze. It isn’t. It really, really isn’t.
OP called it “personal fetishization material” and a “sudden lesbian relationship” that’s just not true. As for the male gaze- that’s what you get with a male author… I mean he’s never been in a lesbian relationship before, I don’t fault him too much. Besides, a handful of pages in a giant comic with recurring female characters is good considering Allison as a whole isn’t being portrayed through the male gaze.
But she has been, though. Read the last book. We had to endure seeing her shirt torn in just such a way that we received several nip-slips. This may seem minor, but considering the amount of thought Abaddon surely puts into each and every panel, it’s clearly a conscious choice. When put in combination with Cio’s overall design change during the heist and the horrible 0001 splash page that even he admitted was “too horny”…it doesn’t paint a pretty picture.
excuse me, it quite literally painted a pretty picture. stop being a fundamentalist prude.
“oh no! sexuality exists” “oh no! men are enjoying something of a sexual nature!” “oh no! we saw nipple!”
whatever happened to live and let live? why is the world filled with zealots who run around trying to ruin other people’s idea of a good time? it’s art for yisun’s sake, literally no one is being hurt by this.
“excuse me, it quite literally painted a pretty picture. stop being a fundamentalist prude.”
Nope! I’m going to critique everything straight men do, because it’s overwhelmingly gross. Sorry! If it makes you feel any better you have tons of sexist content to enjoy literally anywhere else.
are you actually a pepe loving neo-nazi? because every post of yours reads like a parody of SJWs.
If anything, an angry, reactionary cissie with no comprehension of the things she’s complaining against
wait what’s wrong with Cio’s design change?
You’re so bad at this.
hard agree
10/10 troll, post a few sentences of shitpost and gets the entire comment section to write paragraphs. I applaud you, now go away please.
I agree completely. Less Reality MORE FANTASY!
Don’t feed the troll – feed the horse.
Their relationship was anything but sudden, and if you missed that after reading for two years then you are dense indeed. In any case, go take your hate and have a relationship with it, m’kay? Bye now!
I have a lot of sympathy with this point of view. While their relationship has often been hinted to and was the object of ceasless ‘shipping’ in the comments, it was never properly built in the narrative. Along with a couple of time skips, this has produced a homesxual relationship devoid of any nuance or believable foundations. This is frustrating, and it does appear to pander to a certain objectifying male viewpoint. That said, I believe that Abbadon is attempting to present gender and sexuality in an overwhelmingly positive way. I don’t believe that the failure to create an nuanced and sensitive relationship between Allison and Cio reflects any boorishness on his part, but might rather indicate his awareness of the issue. As pointed out, Abaddon is likely a straight cis man with limited LGBTQ experience, so may not feel confident in tackling such a relationship in his writing. As such, the slightly hamfisted, cookie cutter, stereotypical relationship with time jumps and shaky foundations is what we get. I don’t think we should be too critical of someone who is attempting to present LGBTQ characters in a positive way, even if it is lacking greater understanding. It still feels like steps in the right direction to me.
Would now be a good time to mention that Abbadon has a sister who is a lesbian and is close friends with many other queer people?
Also what an utterly back-handed compliment. This is only the first page where it’s been confirmed that Allison and Cio are in a relationship and you (and others) are immediately assuming it’s going to be solely sexualized and male-gazey just because Allison is asking about sex?
“Would now be a good time to mention that Abbadon has a sister who is a lesbian and is close friends with many other queer people?”
Are we really going to do this. Really?
I don’t agree that the relationship wasn’t built in the narrative. It was clear to me that Cio was into Allison from very early on. I think I first twigged to it somewhere around the drinking contest with Princess. Cio and Allison have been dancing around each other for almost the entire comic.
what exactly do you mean by ” a certain objectifying male viewpoint”? like what is the exact view point? cause to me it seems more like the second part of your post than this.
This seems like the most reasonable and thoughtful position.
ok, bye felicia
We won’t miss you. Here we have a healthy lesbian relationship instead of the strong female lead pining after her kind-of-skeezy male hookup, and you’re saying it’s the evils of men. As a steadfast member of the LGBT community: You SJW and third-wave feminazis caused us far more damage and exile than your small minds could ever compute, right when we were on the verge of acceptance. Leave now.
1.) This relationship was not “sudden”, it’s kind of been laid out since the beginning of the series that Allison never really felt she had a place among people back on earth, the only reason she ever hooked up with the shifty dude in the first place is because she didn’t want to be made fun of for being a virgin, and as we saw in the heist arc, she was never very good at introspection. Like…..when you look back on it, there’s a good chance she was written as a lesbian from the very beginning.
2.)In what way is it fetishistic??? It’s not at all tainted by the male gaze; there’s nothing here to say that this isn’t a lasting, genuine relationship (in fact, the end of the heist arc showed us it had great potential to be one), and nothing to say that a relationship with a man would be in any way better.
3.) As a lesbian who is LOVING these new pages so far, I feel that I have the utmost authority to say: “Kindly fuck off from whence ye came, foul pissant”
As a lesbian disaster myself I don’t know what you’re seeing in this b e c a u s e tiny binch demoness in glasses ravishing me sarcastically is exactly my kind of fantasy
Congrats, this was bait of excellent quality.
Ok but…lol. They’ve saved each other’s lives countless times, Cio was writing fanfic about her since the beginning, Allison called Cio her best friend, etc. etc. etc. I know you’re trolling but it has to be said… this is one of the best portrayals of badass women in fiction I’ve ever read, written by a dude or not. Allison is written just like any character in an epic, and it’s feminist AF because it doesn’t even matter she’s a woman. If she was a dude you bet your ass he’d be banging one of his companions.
This is some grade A trolling right here.
I shouldn’t, but I have to. I refer to the panel two pages ago with Allison sitting butt-naked in a bathtub reading a book and gobbling down ramen in the least male gaze way possible. Cio may be an absolute sex idol, but come ON
Goodbye, you won’t be missed.
what level of woke do you have to be on to stop reading something because it has dirty homosexuals, but in a feminist way
All that fucking development of their characters and now you’re mad because Allison suddenly made up her mind after all? Did you completely forget how this character was introduced?
Congratulations on the sex having, Allison
They don’t have bones do they?
“All things can change form” and let’s leave it at that
Good job on Al-Yisun’s hands in panel one.
Can I get a HELL FUCKING YES brothers?
YASSS
Is there symbolism in that the fruit she made in panel 1 looks like a butt with a dildo?
Or am I reading to much into it in the end?
Consider, Preem Erik, the tale of YISUN and the iron plum.
lol says the girl who went straigt up “wanna have sex?”
It seems like this is a game they play now. Cio doesn’t want to be too pushy since that is something the old her would of done (remember the comic right before the time jump when her and Allison shared a cig?) but she is also a demon who is likely ALWAYS dtf. I read the “wanna have sex?” In an almost exasperated tone, having in because CIO, being the minx that she is, would continue to not subtly push the subject. It seems like this thing happens often.
I like it. It feels fairly real, mundane and cute.
In response to, “Go ahead, ask.”
Cio has been teasing us and Alice throughout this entire scene, and this is her acknoedging her handiwork.
That’s how I read it too ^^
Is that perhaps a plum, with a succulent skin only to those who once bore a key?
The YISUN is strong here.
I have to wonder about the plum. Are they just easier to create, maybe? Are plums to this comic what pumpkins are to Homestuck?
==> DEVOUR CHALLENGING PURPLE IRON PLUM
What plum?
In Hinduism, Buddhism, and Jainism, the world of humans is known as “the land of plum trees”. Plus a dozen or so metaphysical references of similar significance. For Christian mystics an apple would be analogous object.
Confusion stems from the widespread nickname of “Indian Blackberry” given to that particular fruit despite it otherwise being known as “Java plum”, “Portuguese plum”, and “Malabar plum”.
aaand not a page too soon!
Remember, girls, it’s not gay is she’s a demon!
Once your parents know you’re fucking a demon they wont even care what gender they are. Works like magic!
Guaranteed!
If *she’s* a demon, it’s definitely gay my dude 😉
(Sssssh. I know)
^^
More specifically, it’s gay if the feminine aspects of Cio are what attract Allison. Yet if the demon aspects are what attract Allison to Cio, then it isn’t gay, it’s closer to xenophilia.
I am down with both, for sure 🙂
Well that escalated quickly, how many layers of ruse are we on now?
at least 5 i think
At this point I’m honestly kinda expecting ‘Fuck’ to be some kind of Throne only board game, like monopoly but with gods instead of streets. Failing that, it’s a ruse so they can both write fanfiction in Alison’s room without fear of being discovered by their house-mates.
I meant ‘Sex’. Ah monopoly
In my Immortal words “AW YISS”
I have created
the plums
that weren’t in
the icebox
and which
you were probably
saving
for Armageddon
Forgive me
they were delicious
so divine
and so demonic
Well done
3 cheers!
Ok, we need details. How does one have sex with a demon? We (I assume I can speak for all) know how the human body works, but how does it work for demons?
Inquiring minds want to know.
THE BLACK CHILDREN OF YS-AESMA WERE UNBOUND AND FORMLESS IN MIND AND BODY WHEN THE CONQUERING KING FIRST TORE INTO HEAVEN AND SLEW OUR BROTHERS. IT WAS FIRST LATER, THROUGH THE HANDS OF HIS DEMIURGES, THAT DEVILS WERE GRANTED MINDS AND BODIES. IT STANDS TO REASON THAT THEIR FORMS EMULATED THEIR CREATORS IN AT LEAST SOME WAYS, SO PHYSICAL COMPATIBILITY IS LIKELY LESS OF AN ISSUE.
Devils are made of formless chaos which really means “whatever’s most convenient at the moment” so I can’t imagine the process is too difficult or dissimilar to the purely human equivalent.
How does one have sex with a demon, you ask?
Well, there’s this flexible tail with a fuzzy tip, which is a highly erogenic zone. First, you tease it a bit, but when the ravaging begins, this tail can be applied in any position you (or the demon) prefer. Tomorrow, if you ask nice, I’ll tell you about the lips, the breasts, and the very unspeakable nether regions…
That’s in the same vein as “wait, how can two women have sex, they don’t have a p****”? Cio isn’t completely covered in shell, and if she has a sex drive she presumably has erogenous zones. And then yeah, there’s that possibly-prehensile tail with its furry tuft….
That said, I remember the scene where Cio struck a match off her tongue. Allison might need that invulnerability….
PLUM! That… was not the thing I expected, and that’s also great.
Fanservice strikes me much lesser, this sort of thing is definetely not my cup of tea. *pondered the simbolism of teacups in this comic and nodded* Yet anuway, KSBD is fucking great, be it with or without fucking,
…but plums do not go “crunch.”
you’ve never had a proper plum, then, my friend
Contemplate, my lovelies, the Grand Enemy That Is Called I, and the tale of the Lie of the Iron Plum.
YISUN is the finest of liars, and like all of that exalted sorority, he is wont to repeat his favorites from time to time.