Having your laborers work themselves to injury or death doesn’t really make economic sense. People are a resource. It’s smart to take care of your resources.
So yeah, rationality and thinking of the long term? benevolence? carefully crafted image? all three? I’m not sure yet.
I can’t remember where I read this, but economists say it’s actually more efficient and lucrative to use paid labour instead of slaves.
Workers with a more intrinsic motivation to work, and who are allowed to rest, will go above and beyond. A slave will simply do what is required to avoid the lash.
Uther "Chaos Angel", Least of Jagganoth's Foreservants
The Centurion’s statement is the path to blind obedience to the orders of a madman.
Citizens are expected to think, to use their own judgement, and to never follow orders blindly.
Citizens are the basis of the State.
If Citizens do not think, then the State is a brute animal and may commit any atrocity in the name of survival. This includes destroying it’s own Citizens.
Failure of the Citizens to think is the eventual downfall of any State, as power hungry demagogues race to fill the gap left by the Citizens.
Perhaps, then, it is passion that is the enemy of this king; the passion which breeds such pain-enduring sacrifice of self. This is a king who cares for his creation, his empire to the exclusion of all else. His pride in his architectured, machined “benevolence” subsumes all other prides. He who strides so near to perfection could not long bear the thought that another may be greater, and so his works must live eternal and in stasis. not to bet trifled with by petty passion and the chaos of desire. Therein does his empire take shape; as a citizen you shall want for nothing, all shall be provided, desire not, for the empire is giving. What greater a thing could one be besides a Citizen! The king does know, but he would never tell, would he.
Indeed, Solomon David’s own conception of himself – that of the righteous and wise ruler – could not tolerate the idea of NOT being that, even for a moment.
Sure, no one else would know. But HE, Solomon David, would know.
Can’t be sure of course, but two pages ago seems to show a few. So far it looks like he has no daughters or at least excludes them from his council, and that women can’t join the military. But who knows what else is going on …
And no doubt something is going on. That guy’s just so fake he’s even managed to trick himself into thinking he’s genuine.
“Hauling gargantuan stone slabs by main strength” is basically the last place, anywhere, one would expect to see women, even in crazy fictional settings.
That said, there were several in the marketplace scenes.
There already was women, its just proximity to Solomon causes ones testosterone to increase thousandfold, so one cannot exactly tell who’s who based on appearances, I’d wager.
Either that or Solly’s kingdom has a bit of an ‘archy problem, i suppose…
Go back two pages, to where they’re walking through the streets. Most visibly a woman standing next to bird-head critter, but there are a couple others, including one sitting on the edge of the causeway when they start walking along it. None among the soldiery or Solomon’s councillors, though.
Can we all take a moment to appreciate that Solomon is the ONE superpowered demigod that -isn’t- a self-centered nihilist? These last few pages have been so refreshing that it’s going to be really unpleasant when the insanity and nihilism of the multiverse comes crashing into the Celestial Empire.
He isn’t nihilistic but he is certainly self centered.
So far, I’ve interpreted most of SD’s actions as a show of strength. He calls his sons out, he walks freely among the people and now will likely lift that stone by himself. All of this is to show his strength. He shows he is not afraid of challengers, he shows that he fears no man on the street. And now he shows that he has the strength of well over a dozen men. His confidence is used as a tool for intimidation and obedience
That, and because even his benevolence is a means of bolstering himself. He holds himself to the highest standards, so he feels all the better when he meets those standards.
In that way, his displays of compassion, wisdom, and righteousness are a display of his strength of *character*.
My understanding is Solomon David takes himself to be the ultimate law. As such, you could consider him the logical extreme of lawful neutral. Anything he does could be defined as the logical conclusion of the absolute nature of the law.
Having said that, there two divergent paths I can see this situation taking. The first path is that the taskmaster is punished for allowing his workers to overwork themselves. The second is that Solomon David himself completes the task to alleviate the overworked men. There is a third possible path, wherein which the WORKERS are the ones that are punished for overworking themselves, but I elect to not imagine that as a logical conclusion of the law and thusly have pruned that possibility from this little exercise.
If Solomon David takes the second path, and does not take the first path, then I will have to redefine my opinion of him.
On the other hand, they guy has built an empire that only seems to work properly because he’s constantly on top of everything? He’s been ruling for a thousand years and yet he hasn’t found an heir to his taste, and his underlings apparently believe they’re expected to work themselves to death for him unless he specifically tells them otherwise? I mean yeah, he’s clearly not as bad as Mottom et al, but he IS doing a lot of things wrong.
Nihilist, maybe not; self-centered egotist, I think you’re being far too optimistic. He’s still a head of the Beast, and the one who represents pride to boot. I note he doesn’t provide his people with high technology (or wheels), wouldn’t want to risk disrupting his “perfect kingdom”. He put the suns in the sky, yet he’s having his people labour to construct his colossal arena where he gets to show off how much better he is than everyone else. He wears a smug smirk on his face wherever he goes. I get the distinct sense that all this philosopher-king crap is a veneer which we’ll eventually get to see past in full.
You don’t think Solomon is self-centered? He is the very embodiment of it; it’s easy to be “benevolent” when literally everyone around you is powerless to so much as harm a hair of your head.
His people love him without choice; without hope. How could they ever disobey?
Make no mistake, Salami Dave is indeed self-centered–see “there is nothing beyond my control”, and an entire council made of his own offspring–but nihilism definitely isn’t his thing. You’re right to recognize that Solomon is a much more complex, stable person than the demiurges we’ve spent time with thus far; and, like his kingdom, it is a breath of fresh air. But if there’s one thing that KSBD has taught us, it is this: every being, godlike or not, is a summation of virtue and vice. Solomon is no exception–but unlike the other demiurges, he actually wants to defy his vice. And perhaps he will. We’ll just have to see.
There is a difference between not being a self-centered nihilist and not *acting* like a self-centered nihilist. Only time will tell whether Solomon David is being or acting.
He can put suns in the sky but his people build his temples with sledges and rope.
You are not kidding. I’ve seen gods like this, and to say they were a bit obsessed with being viewed as “normal” is ridiculous. Some actually disguised themselves and then went around doing *heroic, godly deeds* as if that was a thing for mortals.
Not that I know anything myself about it, right? Pshaw, get real, of course I did! But I might have decided that disguises weren’t worth that much after all. If they don’t see you as normal, you might as well be yourself!
And heck, I didn’t do any worse than Solomon David here.
Eh, my guess is that he /is/ a self-centered Nihilist, just in a slightly less obvious way. Or he has some other, more interesting flaws…
Also, my guess is he’s gonna go haul that stone up there by himself. He shed his robes so as to not get them sweaty, or tear them, or whatever. Or just as an excuse to show off his massive muscles, that might be it too. 😛
SD is no more or less ‘self-centered’ than any other total autarch with godly powers and immortality. In fact, he does a better job of recognizing the reality and agency of others than any of the four other demiurges we’ve seen so far.
Don’t mistake a being that changed the multiverse in battle and hauled not one but two suns into place to keep his people warm…with some dude essentially just like you who either won an election or sprouted from the right set of loins.
It’s pretty heavily implied that Solomon’s kingdom on the surface looks great, but has really harsh punishments. Basically it’s a nice place to live if you’re willing to live within super strict rules.
This realm needs to learn about things like the block and fall and mechanical advantage. We could halve the number of workers per area and keep them working longer.
Abbadon, I just want you to know, I am a simple woman with simple needs and these simple needs are basically well-drawn muscles so please don’t hesitate my good man
I can see it now. He got a bunch of slaves, he genuinely believes they are free people. As soon as he turns his back they’ll go back to getting worked to death.
Or maybe he’ll release these ones and a new batch will be drafted to take their place.
Or in the most hilarious fashion, this puts them behind schedule so they get punished for it.
It’s interesting, everything we see right now is from the viewpoint of Solomon. I don’t think we’re going to see anything wrong or out of order until that changes.
Throne was not built in a day, of course.
I’m pretty sure the Gods of old raised Throne within a day, though
They were gods, though. I think we can cut mere mortals slack for not accomplishing such a feat on a similar time frame.
workers on their shift must learn:
as the key in lock don’t turn
it’s the first dawn that still burns
Although it is quite possible that it was razed in a day.
“You are citizens,” rings more like a grim reminder than a statement of comfort
“Your bodies belong to the state, the state is me, therefore, your bodies belong to me. And I don’t like my bodies broken.”
Either he means that or he legitimately cares for his people
Having your laborers work themselves to injury or death doesn’t really make economic sense. People are a resource. It’s smart to take care of your resources.
So yeah, rationality and thinking of the long term? benevolence? carefully crafted image? all three? I’m not sure yet.
I can’t remember where I read this, but economists say it’s actually more efficient and lucrative to use paid labour instead of slaves.
Workers with a more intrinsic motivation to work, and who are allowed to rest, will go above and beyond. A slave will simply do what is required to avoid the lash.
There would not be citizens, without those who are not, Radchaai.
Nice Ancillary Justice reference.
It is most definitely a grim reminder.
The Centurion’s statement is the path to blind obedience to the orders of a madman.
Citizens are expected to think, to use their own judgement, and to never follow orders blindly.
Citizens are the basis of the State.
If Citizens do not think, then the State is a brute animal and may commit any atrocity in the name of survival. This includes destroying it’s own Citizens.
Failure of the Citizens to think is the eventual downfall of any State, as power hungry demagogues race to fill the gap left by the Citizens.
Perhaps, then, it is passion that is the enemy of this king; the passion which breeds such pain-enduring sacrifice of self. This is a king who cares for his creation, his empire to the exclusion of all else. His pride in his architectured, machined “benevolence” subsumes all other prides. He who strides so near to perfection could not long bear the thought that another may be greater, and so his works must live eternal and in stasis. not to bet trifled with by petty passion and the chaos of desire. Therein does his empire take shape; as a citizen you shall want for nothing, all shall be provided, desire not, for the empire is giving. What greater a thing could one be besides a Citizen! The king does know, but he would never tell, would he.
Hmm I wonder if this is how he normally is or if this is an act?
Both, certainly. Does Solomon David strike you as the type of man to ever lay aside the image he has built of himself?
Indeed, Solomon David’s own conception of himself – that of the righteous and wise ruler – could not tolerate the idea of NOT being that, even for a moment.
Sure, no one else would know. But HE, Solomon David, would know.
This is how he is normally.
How -DARE- someone squander resources that are rightfully his.
“And extremely beefy citizens, at that.”
With feet having incredible coefficients of friction
Word.
A cool little detail is the bags of chalk on their hips
Salami Dave’s law is strict and imposing, but fair. Its first decree:
All citizens of this seventh of the seven-part world shall have
EXTRA THICC MEAT
The meat is the life. Meat shall be the whole of the law.
“I’ll have a #7: Salami with extra meat.”
I approve of this message.
Something about Solomon representing pride tells me he would not like being called “Salami Dave”
But damn if it don’t fit, my esteemed bird-friend.
Does he care about his tools or is he merely watching their growth to choose some strong guy ?
He has seen an opportunity to flex, and is pouncing directly on it.
Oh dear he’s slipping out of his clothes, this is either gonna get weird, sexy, weird and sexy, or sexily weird.
Probably all of the above.
Maybe he’s going to show them how it’s done?
You forgot weirdly sexy
What about weirdly sexy?
One man’s trash is another man’s treasure.
Where the wimmin’ at?
I have not seen one woman in King Sol-boy’s realm so far.
Nah there was a woman with dreads in the last page or the one before it
I would not be surprised to learn that the figure known to many as Solomon-David has some misogynistic views.
I would, considering the entire reason he’s had no daughters is because he’s so heartbroken over the loss of his original wife and daughter.
There were many as they passed through town.
There is one clearly on 1-6 in panel 2.
Go two pages back and you’ll find some.
Can’t be sure of course, but two pages ago seems to show a few. So far it looks like he has no daughters or at least excludes them from his council, and that women can’t join the military. But who knows what else is going on …
And no doubt something is going on. That guy’s just so fake he’s even managed to trick himself into thinking he’s genuine.
Two pages ago, was there not a woman on page?
You can see some as they walk through the city, two pages back.
“Hauling gargantuan stone slabs by main strength” is basically the last place, anywhere, one would expect to see women, even in crazy fictional settings.
That said, there were several in the marketplace scenes.
Would it upset you if I went and helped haul a stone slab? Like, the inefficiency of it?
That’s an incredibly stupid question and you know it.
There already was women, its just proximity to Solomon causes ones testosterone to increase thousandfold, so one cannot exactly tell who’s who based on appearances, I’d wager.
Either that or Solly’s kingdom has a bit of an ‘archy problem, i suppose…
If you’ve got patriarchy problems I feel sorry for you, son…
Something like this, possibly https://www.oglaf.com/son-of-kronar/
There were several on 1-6. But it is an interesting contrast with Allison’s crew.
King Solomon David, ruler of the seven-part world and bearer of the word MPREG.
Go back two pages, to where they’re walking through the streets. Most visibly a woman standing next to bird-head critter, but there are a couple others, including one sitting on the edge of the causeway when they start walking along it. None among the soldiery or Solomon’s councillors, though.
Yeah that’s … unsettling. I’m guessing the answer is going to be deeply disturbing, whatever it is.
I heard the answer is that he was too heartbroken after the loss of his wife and daughter to have another daughter.
Then you weren’t looking good enough! There were women sitting at the bridge and at the town market.
There was one behind Zaid in the previous page, talking to a weird birdlike alien
I saw one two pages ago in the right upper middle panel.
Amazing!
A ruler respects his subjects. ALSO MAN THAT PHYSIQUE!
Oh hey, I wasn’t aware we were going FULL JOJO.
Can we all take a moment to appreciate that Solomon is the ONE superpowered demigod that -isn’t- a self-centered nihilist? These last few pages have been so refreshing that it’s going to be really unpleasant when the insanity and nihilism of the multiverse comes crashing into the Celestial Empire.
He isn’t nihilistic but he is certainly self centered.
So far, I’ve interpreted most of SD’s actions as a show of strength. He calls his sons out, he walks freely among the people and now will likely lift that stone by himself. All of this is to show his strength. He shows he is not afraid of challengers, he shows that he fears no man on the street. And now he shows that he has the strength of well over a dozen men. His confidence is used as a tool for intimidation and obedience
That, and because even his benevolence is a means of bolstering himself. He holds himself to the highest standards, so he feels all the better when he meets those standards.
In that way, his displays of compassion, wisdom, and righteousness are a display of his strength of *character*.
My understanding is Solomon David takes himself to be the ultimate law. As such, you could consider him the logical extreme of lawful neutral. Anything he does could be defined as the logical conclusion of the absolute nature of the law.
Having said that, there two divergent paths I can see this situation taking. The first path is that the taskmaster is punished for allowing his workers to overwork themselves. The second is that Solomon David himself completes the task to alleviate the overworked men. There is a third possible path, wherein which the WORKERS are the ones that are punished for overworking themselves, but I elect to not imagine that as a logical conclusion of the law and thusly have pruned that possibility from this little exercise.
If Solomon David takes the second path, and does not take the first path, then I will have to redefine my opinion of him.
On the other hand, they guy has built an empire that only seems to work properly because he’s constantly on top of everything? He’s been ruling for a thousand years and yet he hasn’t found an heir to his taste, and his underlings apparently believe they’re expected to work themselves to death for him unless he specifically tells them otherwise? I mean yeah, he’s clearly not as bad as Mottom et al, but he IS doing a lot of things wrong.
Nihilist, maybe not; self-centered egotist, I think you’re being far too optimistic. He’s still a head of the Beast, and the one who represents pride to boot. I note he doesn’t provide his people with high technology (or wheels), wouldn’t want to risk disrupting his “perfect kingdom”. He put the suns in the sky, yet he’s having his people labour to construct his colossal arena where he gets to show off how much better he is than everyone else. He wears a smug smirk on his face wherever he goes. I get the distinct sense that all this philosopher-king crap is a veneer which we’ll eventually get to see past in full.
You don’t think Solomon is self-centered? He is the very embodiment of it; it’s easy to be “benevolent” when literally everyone around you is powerless to so much as harm a hair of your head.
His people love him without choice; without hope. How could they ever disobey?
Make no mistake, Salami Dave is indeed self-centered–see “there is nothing beyond my control”, and an entire council made of his own offspring–but nihilism definitely isn’t his thing. You’re right to recognize that Solomon is a much more complex, stable person than the demiurges we’ve spent time with thus far; and, like his kingdom, it is a breath of fresh air. But if there’s one thing that KSBD has taught us, it is this: every being, godlike or not, is a summation of virtue and vice. Solomon is no exception–but unlike the other demiurges, he actually wants to defy his vice. And perhaps he will. We’ll just have to see.
There is a difference between not being a self-centered nihilist and not *acting* like a self-centered nihilist. Only time will tell whether Solomon David is being or acting.
He can put suns in the sky but his people build his temples with sledges and rope.
You are not kidding. I’ve seen gods like this, and to say they were a bit obsessed with being viewed as “normal” is ridiculous. Some actually disguised themselves and then went around doing *heroic, godly deeds* as if that was a thing for mortals.
Not that I know anything myself about it, right? Pshaw, get real, of course I did! But I might have decided that disguises weren’t worth that much after all. If they don’t see you as normal, you might as well be yourself!
And heck, I didn’t do any worse than Solomon David here.
Eh, my guess is that he /is/ a self-centered Nihilist, just in a slightly less obvious way. Or he has some other, more interesting flaws…
Also, my guess is he’s gonna go haul that stone up there by himself. He shed his robes so as to not get them sweaty, or tear them, or whatever. Or just as an excuse to show off his massive muscles, that might be it too. 😛
SD is no more or less ‘self-centered’ than any other total autarch with godly powers and immortality. In fact, he does a better job of recognizing the reality and agency of others than any of the four other demiurges we’ve seen so far.
Don’t mistake a being that changed the multiverse in battle and hauled not one but two suns into place to keep his people warm…with some dude essentially just like you who either won an election or sprouted from the right set of loins.
Overly eager lieutenant? Who misunderstood what his paternum wanted of his work crew? How representative would he be for all of SDs subjects?
Or is this all just an elaborated act to show Zaid that he is the good guy here? I doubt that, but it’s possible.
But at least SD is undressing already to get the work done himself. I wonder how fast HE is in erecting that arena.
It’s a nice touch that a drop of blood forms a heart in the fourth panel.
Such clever artifice!
Great God, tell us more Lies!
This guy thus far seems to be the epitome of Lawful Neutral.
He can’t be this balanced. I can’t wait for the other sandal to drop.
“You are tools of my will, and my will is WORKPLACE SAFETY RULES!”
*earlier that day*
“Behold, my Great Ocean!”
*right now*
“Behold, my great OSHA!”
It’s pretty heavily implied that Solomon’s kingdom on the surface looks great, but has really harsh punishments. Basically it’s a nice place to live if you’re willing to live within super strict rules.
It’s about fucking time we got some manly eye candy.
This realm needs to learn about things like the block and fall and mechanical advantage. We could halve the number of workers per area and keep them working longer.
I know, right? Solomon David’s apparent disdain for technology may make his empire easier to run, but people invent tools for a reason.
Solomon: Let me just slip this off so I can get to flexing.
Mercy is the mark of a man who has never felt the animal fear all men harbor just beyond the bank of civility,
Or else has forgotten the taste.
Or know it too well an found another way.
Abbadon, I just want you to know, I am a simple woman with simple needs and these simple needs are basically well-drawn muscles so please don’t hesitate my good man
I can see it now. He got a bunch of slaves, he genuinely believes they are free people. As soon as he turns his back they’ll go back to getting worked to death.
Or maybe he’ll release these ones and a new batch will be drafted to take their place.
Or in the most hilarious fashion, this puts them behind schedule so they get punished for it.
It’s interesting, everything we see right now is from the viewpoint of Solomon. I don’t think we’re going to see anything wrong or out of order until that changes.
Let’s assume that is a four meter-sided cube.
Let’s say it is made of limestone.
At its minimum usual density, that turns out to be 112,640 kilograms a block.
166,400 if it is marble. Let’s be honest, it’s probably marble. Magical marble.
Anyways. That’s ten guys moving that thing. I don’t care how much of that ramp is making things easier, they’re not just beefy, they’re space marines.
I mean… parties!
It could be hollowed out.